Here is some background and questions to answer about Ivan Ilyich. To begin, I felt it would be important to add some information about Leo Tolstoy and his writings. I have included information directly from this website: http://www.famousauthors.org/leo-tolstoy.
I also am aware Vincent Barry mentions Leo Tolstoy throughout his text Philosophical Thinking About Death and Dying but I cannot find my book to refer to specifics. If you would like to add references back to Barry's text feel free to.
Lev Nikolayevich “Leo” Tolstoy was a Russian author best known for his novels War and Peace and Anna Karenina which are considered to be the greatest novels of realist fiction. Tolstoy is also regarded as world’s best novelist by many. In addition to writing novels, Tolstoy also authored short stories, essays and plays. Also a moral thinker and a social reformer, Tolstoy held severe moralistic views. In later life, he became a fervent Christian anarchist and anarcho-pacifist. His non-violent resistance approach towards life has been expressed in his works such as The Kingdom of God is Within You, which is known to have a profound effect on important 20th century figures, particularly, Martin Luther King Jr. and Mohandas Gandhi. Tolstoy began writing his masterpiece, War and Peace in 1862. The six volumes of the work were published between 1863 and 1869. With 580 characters fetched from history and others created by Tolstoy, this great novel takes on exploring the theory of history and the insignificance of noted figures such as Alexander and Napoleon. Anna Karenina, Tolstoy’s next epic was started in 1873 and published completely in 1878. Among his earliest publications are autobiographical works such as Childhood, Boyhood and Youth (1852-1856). Although they are works of fiction, the novels reveal aspects of Leo’s own life and experiences. Tolstoy was a master of writing about the Russian society, evidence of which is displayed in The Cossacks (1863). His later works such as The Death of Ivan Ilyich (1886) and What Is to Be Done? (1901) focus on Christian themes. In his late years, Tolstoy became increasingly inclined towards ascetic morality and believed sternly in the Sermon on the Mount and non violent resistance.
Questions:
1. Why is it important to recognize your own mortality?
2. Do you think how Ivan decided to separate himself from his family due to work caused him to live his unhappy life? -Is this something that is done today? Are people this selfish in today’s world? Relate your answer to Ivan’s death-did he die lonely? Is there other ways Ivan should have lived in order to die happier or better?
3. Ivan mainly talked to Gerasim about his issues, why was this? Do you think Ivan should have communicated more with his family? Why or why not?
4. Discuss how the idea of Right to Life can relate to this story.
5. I know we are all still young, but like Ivan how he looked back on his life and realized he did not live as joyful as he should have (besides in his childhood), do you have that same feeling? Have you lived the best life possible so far? Is there anything you wish you could go back and “re-do” or start over? If you talk to any elderly person, is there anything they would “re-do”?
6. When a person is ill (with a death threating illness) is it right for them to not enjoy anything else in life? Should they separate themselves from their loved ones?
7. Reflect on the end of the story when Ivan is going through his last minutes/hours of life, when he ponders about death and asks himself questions such as “Is this the real thing?, Pain, where are you?, Death, where is it?, What death?”
8. What message did you get out of this story (if any)? Any thoughts or opinions about Ivan that you would like to add?
I think that the story demands that people recognize their own mortality precisely so that they do not end up in the situation that Ivan Ilyich did. Throughout his life, Ivan lived "properly" and according to societal norms, and so it came as such a shock to him that he was going to die and he could not understand why. He spent his whole life the way that he supposedly was supposed to, so he could not understand the misery, the pain, and the imminent death that he suddently realized awaited him. In order to live a more fulfilling life, we should recognize our own mortality and consequently live for ourselves (and not society) lest we end up in Ivan's situation. It was too late for Ivan to live in the light of death, but it is not to late for us.
RE: Prompt 3
Ivan felt much closer to his butler than anyone in his family, because seemingly Gerasim alone realized what Iylich was going through. Everyone else--his wife, his children (with the exception of maybe his son), his colleagues and coworkers--shrouded the whole in matter in what he saw as lies: "Okay, yeah, he's dying. We can go through the formalities and ask him how he is doing. But what now?" It seemed that only Gerasim recognized Ivan's humanity and was caring for him as he might hope someone else would care for him on his own deathbed. Ivan could have opened up to his family about their lies, but I think that Ivan astutely recognized that this would be ineffectual. They were living their lives as Ivan always had: shunted from death and objectively viewing there mortality.
RE: Prompt 7
I really loved the end of the story. He became so transcendent to the pain of his plight and really came to terms with what was going to happen to him. To me, this would be the best way to die: to accept our ultimate mortality and go peacefully into the night. It was a really moving conclusion to the book.
Q 3 – I think Ivan talked to Gerasim because Gerasim accepted Ivan for who he was and what he wanted to be. Ivan just wanted someone to acknowledge that he was dying and for someone to take care of him. Whether Gerasim was just doing this to pacify Ivan or because Ivan was Gerasim’s employer; Gerasim gave Ivan the care that was needed and did it without complaint. I think Gerasim is the example of true goodness in this book of selfishness and egos. I really think that Ivan should have communicated more with his family, especially his children. He sons had true love and concern for him. His daughter’s opinion was influenced by her mother but Ivan and his daughter could have had a better relationship if he chose to communicate with his family more. Instead he died unhappy and resentful.
Q 5 – first off, I think it’s incredibly sad that Ivan looks back on his life and his is disappointed on how he lived it. I could not imagine a more awful feeling than being on your death bed and not feeling at peace or proud of the life that you lived. Saying that, I am currently at peace with the life I have lived so far. I try to tell people how I feel and I’ve mended friendships that need it and ended some that were toxic. I have no major regrets on my life because even the small regrets are learning experiences. As cheesy as it sounds its true. Recently, for my gerontology class I did a project on the life of my grandpa and I asked him many of these same questions. When I asked him if he had any regrets he said no; that everything is good now. And I asked him if he had any favorite memories; he laughed and said “there are too many good ones to list them all”. I hope that when I am 82 years old (hopefully I reach that age) that I am as happy and content with life as my grandfather.
Q 6 – I don’t think that an ill person should seclude themselves away from their family and away from life. When Ivan stopped leaving his home and seeing his family it made him more miserable than before. I think secluding yourself from happiness and family who love you is punishing yourself, and to punish yourself for being sick makes no sense to me. If I was to ever get terminally sick I would want to spend the last part of my life with my family and doing all the things that make me happy. I recognize that this was in a different time period and in a different country but the same fears of life and death I believe still apply; people just wanted to be loved and cared for in live and in death.
Q1 The reason why the story puts an emphasis on morality, is because Ivan lived a proper life and lived according to the social norms. This led to him to be shocked to find out that he is dying because he lived life to the social standard. This book helps you understand why you should live by your standards to have a more fulfilling life. Q4 The right to life is related to this book because the book is telling us that as a human race we need to have the right to live the way we want to. Also this book is related to the right to life because Ivan didn't express this right because he lived by “society rules” and didn't express his right to live life to the fullest. Q8 The message that I got out of this story is that you need to live life to the fullest and live on you own terms not society’s. Also Ivan was depressed because he didn't live the right life, he lived to please society and in the end of his life he wasn't happy.
Q1: It is important to recognize your own mortality so that you can live your life to the fullest. The novel describes Ivan’s life to be in denial of his mortality and it is to teach the reader to be aware of their own mortality and not to make the same mistakes that Ivan made by living his life in accordance with propriety. He values social status and material objects over relationships with his wife, family, and friends. Finally, at the time of his death he realizes that he has not lived his life “correctly.” He finds that he was happier when his life was not focused solely on his work and alienating himself from his family. We are to identify our own mortality so that we can live an authentic life.
Q2: I do agree that as a result of Ivan separating himself from his family for work caused him to live an unhappy and unsatisfying life. This definitely occurs in our society today. People are selfish and strive only to obtain a high social status and material things. While doing this, they make the same mistake that Ivan did, they lose touch with what really matters in life, and that is the bonds formed with others. Some people work their lives away and miss out on their children growing up along with many other significant events. I think that besides having the company of Gerasim, Ivan died a lonely man. His fenced himself in and alienated himself from his wife and the rest of his family. He could have died “happier” or “better” if he had maintained a close relationship with his wife and kids because he would look back on his life and be satisfied that he lived his life “correctly” and authentically as opposed to his artificial life he did lead.
Q4: The right to life can apply to this story from two ways, the artificial life and the authentic life. Ivan lives a life of propriety and only works to obtain a high social status and material things. The life he leads is artificial and leaves him feeling empty inside and very lonely because he alienates himself from society as he works all the time and does not create bonds with his wife and children. His shallow relationship with others isolates him as a person and leaves him in a terrified state of death. The authentic life on the other hand allows for people to create deeper relationships with family and friends, which permits them to be more accepting of death because they are satisfied with the way they lived their life. Gerasim depicts the true meaning of the authentic life and is one of the only people who actually understands that Ivan is dying and has compassion for him as he suffers.
1. Recognizing one’s own mortality allows the person to realize the value of life. I think when you recognize your own mortality you realize and also are able to internalize that the loved ones in your life are what is most important. When Ivan Ilyich comprehended that he was dying he realized the lack of love and, in effect, value in his life. This left Ivan in an agonizing miserable state during the last months of his life. Ivan is miserable because he realizes he is not close to anyone and has not led a fulfilling life. He has regrets and these regrets make him miserable. 2. In the beginning of the story Ivan expressed that his desires were to climb the ladder in his career. His goals in life were to attain raises and promotions. With his focus on work he became deeply separated from the people in his life. The stresses and pressures of work added to his unhappy life and the continued feeling of separation from people added more unhappiness. Multiple aspects contributed to Ivan’s unhappy life, but they are all connected Yes this happens today and yes people are selfish (but definitely not all people). Ivan was a selfish man, thinking of himself and his work foremost. Frequently, Ivan’s family was mentioned only when it was about providing for them financially and the fights he had with his wife. Ivan should have recognized his mortality earlier. If he did, hopefully he would have valued the people in his life. To find true happiness Ivan should have valued the people close to him.
3. Ivan described his relationship with Gerasim as comforting and enjoyed the trueness of Gerasim. While Ivan continuously said his family and doctors were lying to him, Gerasim was kind and did not lie. I believe the kindness that Gerasim showed allowed Ivan to talk to him and fancy his presence. While Ivan was distancing himself from his family, his family also separated themselves from Ivan. Ivan’s wife would frequently offer opium to help his pain and promptly leave whereas Gerasim would stay and hold Ivan’s feet to comfort him. Even if Ivan communicated with this family, at this point it might have been hopeless. His family also separated themselves from Ivan and with so many years of distance communicating probably would not help Ivan have a more peaceful death. An apology would help Ivan feel better but would not erase the decades of regret that he was feeling.
Q1: I feel that it is important to recognize your own mortality so that you can work harder to accomplish the things that you want in life. We know that when death comes there are no more chances. Knowing this we work to accomplish as much as we can in the limited amount of time that we have. Since we do not know how much time we have exactly, we strive to do things right the first time and make the right decisions. When we look back on our life at the time of death, whenever that may be, we want to feel satisfied with our life and not have any regrets. If we don’t recognize our own mortality this may not be the case. If we choose to ignore the fact that we are going to die at some point, we may feel that we have forever to do the things that we want. This may cause us to keep pushing things off until we realize that it is too late, and then we may have regrets and may not be satisfied with our lives when we reflect on it. Just like in the story, Ivan begins to reflect on his life because he realizes his own mortality, but he realizes it too late. He notices that the majority of his decisions were made based on what he thought others expected of him and that he had built up all these walls around him preventing him from having any real close and personal relationship with anyone including his family. At this point there isn’t anything he can do about it except die and leave his family because he thinks that it would the best thing for them.
Q5: For the most part I feel that I have lived the best life possible for me so far. The only regrets I really have are that I wish I had more time to spend with my family and friends. This would not be something I would deeply regret if I were to die today, because I do spend time with my family friends, I just wish I had more time to spend with them. I am very proud of my accomplishments and I feel that I try my hardest in everything that I do. I feel that the major choices that I have made in my life reflect the things that I want, and not what I think that other’s expect of me.
As I mentioned in class, I interviewed my great aunt for a paper in my gerontology clinical and her major regret was that she wished she had spent more time with her children and had given them better advice. Her major fear in life is that she will get a disease that will debilitate her and make her dependent on her friends and family. She said that she does not want others to have to take care of her and she does not want to be remembered in that way.
Q5: If I were dying I would feel as if I have lived the best life I could have. I worked hard to get to where I am today and have always treated others kindly and with respect. I am close to my family and friends and do not have any regrets what so ever. I would not want to go back and re-do anything because the mistakes I have made in the past have shaped me and made me into the person I am today. Although, I obviously would not want to die soon, I would not have any loose ties that have been left untended. I want to live out a full and authentic life and accomplish my goals and experience new things.
Q6: Just because a person is ill does not mean that they should separate themselves from their loved ones and not enjoy life as much as they can. In fact, people with death threatening illnesses should spend as much time with their loved ones as possible because their time here on Earth is dwindling. They should spend their final months and days with the ones they cherish the most and reflect back on the happy times with friends and family there to support them.
4-This is one of the questions that jumps out to me, since we talked in groups about this in class last week, for some reason I keep thinking about it and Ivan Ilych. There are many people in this world that act the way they do because that is what society thinks they should do. Although I haven't done exactly what "society says" (I had a baby before I got married), I have grown up with the values and what society has taught me. Well I guess society hasn't taught me anything rather it has preached certain ways that people should live their lives. There are many people today that follow society, but there are also many people that do not follow the "norm". But, for question 4, I think that people should have the right to live their own lives and not worry about society, people shouldn't have to feel judged at every step of the way. They need to feel supported and shouldn't be self-conscious or constantly trying to impress someone else. As much as a person has the right to life, they have the right to death. They should be able to choose how they want to die. If they want to die surrounded by the people they love, that's great, if they want to die in alone in peace, then that is great too. Family members aren't the one that is dying so they should not be the ones to tell the dying person how they should die. They are capable of making their own decisions and that is what they should be allowed to do. In class, many people said they wouldn't want to die alone and they also said that if someone did distance themselves from their family, then the family should respect those wishes and let the person be alone.
Question 1: It is very important for people to recognize their own mortality for many reasons. I believe that if people recognize this mortality, it can change the way they lead their life. Hopefully for the better. I think it would make people more conscientious of their decisions, realizing that they do not live forever. I think if people are more aware of their own mortality, that it could make them more aware of the mortality of others around them. This could cause them spend more quality time with those that they love. Maybe it would even make the grieving process easier for when a close one passes.
Question 6: I believe that even if a person is ill that it does not mean that they can no longer enjoy life. I think it is important to cherish those last moments with your support system and with your family. I understand why Ivan wanted to be alone. I do not think it is because he wanted to be in isolation so that others did not see him suffer, but because he did not want his wife, who he never truly loved, to be around him. He resented her and most of those around him. I can understand that some do want to be isolated because they do not want loved ones to see them suffer.
Question 1:I believe it is important to recognize our own mortality because if we fail to do so we are left scrambling with end of life decisions and determining whether or not our lives were meaningful or not. Too often, especially in young people, we believe that we are undefeatable and will live forever. This is not so, and early recognition of our mortality will not only help us to make decisions for that time but we may be able to help others who have not given a thought to death. Question 5: I know if I died today I would not be satisfied because I have this feeling there is still more I need to accomplish. However, I feel that I have lived a pretty damn good life so far and do not regret anything. I do not wish to "re-do" anything because those are mistakes I have learned from. My grandma and mom are always telling me to do this or that with my life so that I'll have a more meaningful life, well you know what I am the judge, jury, and executioner of my happiness and will take their opinion into consideration. I do not know what it is that I need to "discover" in order to have a meaningful life. I feel that once I have come across this "meaninful life" it will slap me in the face and then I will realize "Oh, this was what I was looking for", but until then I'm still searching to determine what is most meaningful.
It is important to recognize your own mortality to recognize your own vitality. Often times we lose sight of meaning and take things for granted; the luxuries we enjoy, the food we get to eat, our family and friends... Sometimes, for us to realize this, they must be threatened to be taken away. Such works for life. We see it all the times in movies, books... but when it happens in real life is when it is instilled the most.
Q1: It's crucial to know your mortality because you don't want to be like Ivan, and look back on your life and realize that you haven't done everything you wanted to do. I think knowing your own death is a motivator to live your life to the fullest and knowing that it's okay to take risks and doing the crazier things in life. It also helps us appreciate what and who we have in our lives, because we never know if they will be gone.
Q5: I'm still young and I know I wouldn't be satisfied with dying. There are so many things I want to do and I can't do them until I reach like an old age. I feel like I've lived a good life with all the decisions that I've made. I have a great family that supports me, I go to a good school, and I appreciate everything I have so far in my life that I don't have any regrets thus far.
8. What message did you get out of this story (if any)? Any thoughts or opinions about Ivan that you would like to add? **I got a lot out of this story because it's so true with every case of death that nobody is ever ready for it and feels untouchable until they actually get a glimpse of what is happening to them. Panic and fear is what I want to avoid in my death and build up a confidence that I've done all I could at the end of the day to be a better person and be completely honest with every person that I come in contact with.
6. When a person is ill (with a death threating illness) is it right for them to not enjoy anything else in life? Should they separate themselves from their loved ones? **I watched my best friend's mom deteriorate in front of me until the day they gave her 2 weeks to live and she embraced everyone around her rather than shutting herself of our lives. I would never want someone I love to suffer in silence and not enjoy what they have left with the people they have left.
5. When it comes to "redoing" situations in my life, I firmly believe that everything happens for a reason. I don't think things happen on accident.. But I truly do believe that the way you handle the cards you are dealt can change "fate". So, essentially, I believe we can control the emotions in our fate. With that being said, I don't think I have handled certain situations as well as I could have. I have had a very indecisive journey in college and have transferred schools twice--believing that happiness lied within a school, and not in the experience I made in that school. That is essentially where I would go back and redo. I would try harder to make a positive situation instead of relenting and waiting for it to fall in my lap. The last thing I'd want to do is look back on my college experience and think that I lived it like Ivan. When it comes to college, society is full of it's own opinions and guidelines on how to do it the "right" way. I listened to a lot of those. I took too much heed in trying to satisfy my parents and those around me. In a sense I made a lot of decisions like Ivan did; however, I am a different and better person as a result of it. I'd like to think that I am stronger, with a better sense of identity and stronger sense of independence and self. *steps off soapbox*
I think that it is very important that we recognize our own mortality. Looking at Ivan, we do not want to end up in that situation. He avoided thinking about his death; he refused to recognize his own mortality. Ivan lived his life the way society told him to. He ignored the reality of death, and when faced with his own death, was not prepared to deal with it. It is important that we recognize our own mortality, so that we can live our lives out to their fullest potential. Death gives meaning to life, and recognizing our own mortality plays an important part in helping us live our life to its fullest. By recognizing our own mortality, we can be ensured to not end up like Ivan.
Part of the joy in life is the people we met during our lifetime. Ivan separated himself from his family. He threw himself into his work, and ignored all other aspects of his life. And while it may have made him happy at the time, later he realized that his life was very unsatisfying. People today do the same thing. I know many people who just become so focused on work, and going through the day to day motions, that they never take the time to enjoy all that life has to offer. People miss out on some of life greatest moments. I have a friend whose father was not present at his son's birth because he was on a business trip. He is never home, and their family is always alone. It's sad because at some point the father is going to realize that his life has been unsatisfying. Sure he is very successful and is very rich, but he has thrown his life away, missing some of the greatest moment's life has to offer. Obviously people should not quit their jobs and enjoy life every second of the day every day, but for people like Ivan, who throw themselves into their work and separate themselves from their families and the rest of the world, they will eventually realize that their life is unhappy and unfulfilling.
The reason that Ivan spoke to Gerasim was because Gerasim recognized the humanity of Ivan. Gerasim handled Ivan's impending death in a way much different than everyone else. It seemed like Gerasim was the only one who related to Ivan, and was able to understand what he was going through. That being said, I do think that Ivan should have involved his family more. Throughout his life, he constantly separated himself from his family, distancing himself so to focus more on his own selfish desires, namely his work. Death is not something people should be forced to go through alone. Families should function as support groups, helping its members through tough and trying times. A hallmark of what makes a family a family should be their ability to discuss anything. Gerasim was the most understanding, so it was good for Ivan to speak with him, but he should have also tried to talk with his family more. At the same time, from Ivan's perspective, it may not have been worth it to discuss it with his family. They viewed death in much the same way, refusing to recognize the reality of their own mortality. Either way, Ivan should have at least attempted to communicate with his family more. If anything, it may at least cause them to change their attitude towards death. Maybe opening up to them may allow them to recognize their own mortality, and in turn allow them to appreciate life while they still have the opportunity.
Here is some background and questions to answer about Ivan Ilyich. To begin, I felt it would be important to add some information about Leo Tolstoy and his writings. I have included information directly from this website: http://www.famousauthors.org/leo-tolstoy.
ReplyDeleteI also am aware Vincent Barry mentions Leo Tolstoy throughout his text Philosophical Thinking About Death and Dying but I cannot find my book to refer to specifics. If you would like to add references back to Barry's text feel free to.
Lev Nikolayevich “Leo” Tolstoy was a Russian author best known for his novels War and Peace and Anna Karenina which are considered to be the greatest novels of realist fiction. Tolstoy is also regarded as world’s best novelist by many. In addition to writing novels, Tolstoy also authored short stories, essays and plays. Also a moral thinker and a social reformer, Tolstoy held severe moralistic views. In later life, he became a fervent Christian anarchist and anarcho-pacifist. His non-violent resistance approach towards life has been expressed in his works such as The Kingdom of God is Within You, which is known to have a profound effect on important 20th century figures, particularly, Martin Luther King Jr. and Mohandas Gandhi.
Tolstoy began writing his masterpiece, War and Peace in 1862. The six volumes of the work were published between 1863 and 1869. With 580 characters fetched from history and others created by Tolstoy, this great novel takes on exploring the theory of history and the insignificance of noted figures such as Alexander and Napoleon. Anna Karenina, Tolstoy’s next epic was started in 1873 and published completely in 1878. Among his earliest publications are autobiographical works such as Childhood, Boyhood and Youth (1852-1856). Although they are works of fiction, the novels reveal aspects of Leo’s own life and experiences. Tolstoy was a master of writing about the Russian society, evidence of which is displayed in The Cossacks (1863). His later works such as The Death of Ivan Ilyich (1886) and What Is to Be Done? (1901) focus on Christian themes.
In his late years, Tolstoy became increasingly inclined towards ascetic morality and believed sternly in the Sermon on the Mount and non violent resistance.
Questions:
1. Why is it important to recognize your own mortality?
2. Do you think how Ivan decided to separate himself from his family due to work caused him to live his unhappy life? -Is this something that is done today? Are people this selfish in today’s world? Relate your answer to Ivan’s death-did he die lonely? Is there other ways Ivan should have lived in order to die happier or better?
3. Ivan mainly talked to Gerasim about his issues, why was this? Do you think Ivan should have communicated more with his family? Why or why not?
4. Discuss how the idea of Right to Life can relate to this story.
5. I know we are all still young, but like Ivan how he looked back on his life and realized he did not live as joyful as he should have (besides in his childhood), do you have that same feeling? Have you lived the best life possible so far? Is there anything you wish you could go back and “re-do” or start over? If you talk to any elderly person, is there anything they would “re-do”?
6. When a person is ill (with a death threating illness) is it right for them to not enjoy anything else in life? Should they separate themselves from their loved ones?
7. Reflect on the end of the story when Ivan is going through his last minutes/hours of life, when he ponders about death and asks himself questions such as “Is this the real thing?, Pain, where are you?, Death, where is it?, What death?”
8. What message did you get out of this story (if any)? Any thoughts or opinions about Ivan that you would like to add?
RE: Prompt 1
ReplyDeleteI think that the story demands that people recognize their own mortality precisely so that they do not end up in the situation that Ivan Ilyich did. Throughout his life, Ivan lived "properly" and according to societal norms, and so it came as such a shock to him that he was going to die and he could not understand why. He spent his whole life the way that he supposedly was supposed to, so he could not understand the misery, the pain, and the imminent death that he suddently realized awaited him. In order to live a more fulfilling life, we should recognize our own mortality and consequently live for ourselves (and not society) lest we end up in Ivan's situation. It was too late for Ivan to live in the light of death, but it is not to late for us.
RE: Prompt 3
Ivan felt much closer to his butler than anyone in his family, because seemingly Gerasim alone realized what Iylich was going through. Everyone else--his wife, his children (with the exception of maybe his son), his colleagues and coworkers--shrouded the whole in matter in what he saw as lies: "Okay, yeah, he's dying. We can go through the formalities and ask him how he is doing. But what now?" It seemed that only Gerasim recognized Ivan's humanity and was caring for him as he might hope someone else would care for him on his own deathbed. Ivan could have opened up to his family about their lies, but I think that Ivan astutely recognized that this would be ineffectual. They were living their lives as Ivan always had: shunted from death and objectively viewing there mortality.
RE: Prompt 7
I really loved the end of the story. He became so transcendent to the pain of his plight and really came to terms with what was going to happen to him. To me, this would be the best way to die: to accept our ultimate mortality and go peacefully into the night. It was a really moving conclusion to the book.
Q 3 – I think Ivan talked to Gerasim because Gerasim accepted Ivan for who he was and what he wanted to be. Ivan just wanted someone to acknowledge that he was dying and for someone to take care of him. Whether Gerasim was just doing this to pacify Ivan or because Ivan was Gerasim’s employer; Gerasim gave Ivan the care that was needed and did it without complaint. I think Gerasim is the example of true goodness in this book of selfishness and egos. I really think that Ivan should have communicated more with his family, especially his children. He sons had true love and concern for him. His daughter’s opinion was influenced by her mother but Ivan and his daughter could have had a better relationship if he chose to communicate with his family more. Instead he died unhappy and resentful.
ReplyDeleteQ 5 – first off, I think it’s incredibly sad that Ivan looks back on his life and his is disappointed on how he lived it. I could not imagine a more awful feeling than being on your death bed and not feeling at peace or proud of the life that you lived. Saying that, I am currently at peace with the life I have lived so far. I try to tell people how I feel and I’ve mended friendships that need it and ended some that were toxic. I have no major regrets on my life because even the small regrets are learning experiences. As cheesy as it sounds its true. Recently, for my gerontology class I did a project on the life of my grandpa and I asked him many of these same questions. When I asked him if he had any regrets he said no; that everything is good now. And I asked him if he had any favorite memories; he laughed and said “there are too many good ones to list them all”. I hope that when I am 82 years old (hopefully I reach that age) that I am as happy and content with life as my grandfather.
Q 6 – I don’t think that an ill person should seclude themselves away from their family and away from life. When Ivan stopped leaving his home and seeing his family it made him more miserable than before. I think secluding yourself from happiness and family who love you is punishing yourself, and to punish yourself for being sick makes no sense to me. If I was to ever get terminally sick I would want to spend the last part of my life with my family and doing all the things that make me happy. I recognize that this was in a different time period and in a different country but the same fears of life and death I believe still apply; people just wanted to be loved and cared for in live and in death.
Q1
ReplyDeleteThe reason why the story puts an emphasis on morality, is because Ivan lived a proper life and lived according to the social norms. This led to him to be shocked to find out that he is dying because he lived life to the social standard. This book helps you understand why you should live by your standards to have a more fulfilling life.
Q4
The right to life is related to this book because the book is telling us that as a human race we need to have the right to live the way we want to. Also this book is related to the right to life because Ivan didn't express this right because he lived by “society rules” and didn't express his right to live life to the fullest.
Q8
The message that I got out of this story is that you need to live life to the fullest and live on you own terms not society’s. Also Ivan was depressed because he didn't live the right life, he lived to please society and in the end of his life he wasn't happy.
Q1:
ReplyDeleteIt is important to recognize your own mortality so that you can live your life to the fullest. The novel describes Ivan’s life to be in denial of his mortality and it is to teach the reader to be aware of their own mortality and not to make the same mistakes that Ivan made by living his life in accordance with propriety. He values social status and material objects over relationships with his wife, family, and friends. Finally, at the time of his death he realizes that he has not lived his life “correctly.” He finds that he was happier when his life was not focused solely on his work and alienating himself from his family. We are to identify our own mortality so that we can live an authentic life.
Q2:
I do agree that as a result of Ivan separating himself from his family for work caused him to live an unhappy and unsatisfying life. This definitely occurs in our society today. People are selfish and strive only to obtain a high social status and material things. While doing this, they make the same mistake that Ivan did, they lose touch with what really matters in life, and that is the bonds formed with others. Some people work their lives away and miss out on their children growing up along with many other significant events. I think that besides having the company of Gerasim, Ivan died a lonely man. His fenced himself in and alienated himself from his wife and the rest of his family. He could have died “happier” or “better” if he had maintained a close relationship with his wife and kids because he would look back on his life and be satisfied that he lived his life “correctly” and authentically as opposed to his artificial life he did lead.
Q4:
ReplyDeleteThe right to life can apply to this story from two ways, the artificial life and the authentic life. Ivan lives a life of propriety and only works to obtain a high social status and material things. The life he leads is artificial and leaves him feeling empty inside and very lonely because he alienates himself from society as he works all the time and does not create bonds with his wife and children. His shallow relationship with others isolates him as a person and leaves him in a terrified state of death. The authentic life on the other hand allows for people to create deeper relationships with family and friends, which permits them to be more accepting of death because they are satisfied with the way they lived their life. Gerasim depicts the true meaning of the authentic life and is one of the only people who actually understands that Ivan is dying and has compassion for him as he suffers.
1. Recognizing one’s own mortality allows the person to realize the value of life. I think when you recognize your own mortality you realize and also are able to internalize that the loved ones in your life are what is most important. When Ivan Ilyich comprehended that he was dying he realized the lack of love and, in effect, value in his life. This left Ivan in an agonizing miserable state during the last months of his life. Ivan is miserable because he realizes he is not close to anyone and has not led a fulfilling life. He has regrets and these regrets make him miserable.
ReplyDelete2. In the beginning of the story Ivan expressed that his desires were to climb the ladder in his career. His goals in life were to attain raises and promotions. With his focus on work he became deeply separated from the people in his life. The stresses and pressures of work added to his unhappy life and the continued feeling of separation from people added more unhappiness. Multiple aspects contributed to Ivan’s unhappy life, but they are all connected
Yes this happens today and yes people are selfish (but definitely not all people). Ivan was a selfish man, thinking of himself and his work foremost. Frequently, Ivan’s family was mentioned only when it was about providing for them financially and the fights he had with his wife. Ivan should have recognized his mortality earlier. If he did, hopefully he would have valued the people in his life. To find true happiness Ivan should have valued the people close to him.
3. Ivan described his relationship with Gerasim as comforting and enjoyed the trueness of Gerasim. While Ivan continuously said his family and doctors were lying to him, Gerasim was kind and did not lie. I believe the kindness that Gerasim showed allowed Ivan to talk to him and fancy his presence. While Ivan was distancing himself from his family, his family also separated themselves from Ivan. Ivan’s wife would frequently offer opium to help his pain and promptly leave whereas Gerasim would stay and hold Ivan’s feet to comfort him. Even if Ivan communicated with this family, at this point it might have been hopeless. His family also separated themselves from Ivan and with so many years of distance communicating probably would not help Ivan have a more peaceful death. An apology would help Ivan feel better but would not erase the decades of regret that he was feeling.
Q1: I feel that it is important to recognize your own mortality so that you can work harder to accomplish the things that you want in life. We know that when death comes there are no more chances. Knowing this we work to accomplish as much as we can in the limited amount of time that we have. Since we do not know how much time we have exactly, we strive to do things right the first time and make the right decisions. When we look back on our life at the time of death, whenever that may be, we want to feel satisfied with our life and not have any regrets. If we don’t recognize our own mortality this may not be the case. If we choose to ignore the fact that we are going to die at some point, we may feel that we have forever to do the things that we want. This may cause us to keep pushing things off until we realize that it is too late, and then we may have regrets and may not be satisfied with our lives when we reflect on it. Just like in the story, Ivan begins to reflect on his life because he realizes his own mortality, but he realizes it too late. He notices that the majority of his decisions were made based on what he thought others expected of him and that he had built up all these walls around him preventing him from having any real close and personal relationship with anyone including his family. At this point there isn’t anything he can do about it except die and leave his family because he thinks that it would the best thing for them.
ReplyDeleteQ5: For the most part I feel that I have lived the best life possible for me so far. The only regrets I really have are that I wish I had more time to spend with my family and friends. This would not be something I would deeply regret if I were to die today, because I do spend time with my family friends, I just wish I had more time to spend with them. I am very proud of my accomplishments and I feel that I try my hardest in everything that I do. I feel that the major choices that I have made in my life reflect the things that I want, and not what I think that other’s expect of me.
As I mentioned in class, I interviewed my great aunt for a paper in my gerontology clinical and her major regret was that she wished she had spent more time with her children and had given them better advice. Her major fear in life is that she will get a disease that will debilitate her and make her dependent on her friends and family. She said that she does not want others to have to take care of her and she does not want to be remembered in that way.
Q5:
ReplyDeleteIf I were dying I would feel as if I have lived the best life I could have. I worked hard to get to where I am today and have always treated others kindly and with respect. I am close to my family and friends and do not have any regrets what so ever. I would not want to go back and re-do anything because the mistakes I have made in the past have shaped me and made me into the person I am today. Although, I obviously would not want to die soon, I would not have any loose ties that have been left untended. I want to live out a full and authentic life and accomplish my goals and experience new things.
Q6:
Just because a person is ill does not mean that they should separate themselves from their loved ones and not enjoy life as much as they can. In fact, people with death threatening illnesses should spend as much time with their loved ones as possible because their time here on Earth is dwindling. They should spend their final months and days with the ones they cherish the most and reflect back on the happy times with friends and family there to support them.
4-This is one of the questions that jumps out to me, since we talked in groups about this in class last week, for some reason I keep thinking about it and Ivan Ilych. There are many people in this world that act the way they do because that is what society thinks they should do. Although I haven't done exactly what "society says" (I had a baby before I got married), I have grown up with the values and what society has taught me. Well I guess society hasn't taught me anything rather it has preached certain ways that people should live their lives. There are many people today that follow society, but there are also many people that do not follow the "norm". But, for question 4, I think that people should have the right to live their own lives and not worry about society, people shouldn't have to feel judged at every step of the way. They need to feel supported and shouldn't be self-conscious or constantly trying to impress someone else. As much as a person has the right to life, they have the right to death. They should be able to choose how they want to die. If they want to die surrounded by the people they love, that's great, if they want to die in alone in peace, then that is great too. Family members aren't the one that is dying so they should not be the ones to tell the dying person how they should die. They are capable of making their own decisions and that is what they should be allowed to do. In class, many people said they wouldn't want to die alone and they also said that if someone did distance themselves from their family, then the family should respect those wishes and let the person be alone.
ReplyDeleteQuestion 1: It is very important for people to recognize their own mortality for many reasons. I believe that if people recognize this mortality, it can change the way they lead their life. Hopefully for the better. I think it would make people more conscientious of their decisions, realizing that they do not live forever. I think if people are more aware of their own mortality, that it could make them more aware of the mortality of others around them. This could cause them spend more quality time with those that they love. Maybe it would even make the grieving process easier for when a close one passes.
ReplyDeleteQuestion 6: I believe that even if a person is ill that it does not mean that they can no longer enjoy life. I think it is important to cherish those last moments with your support system and with your family. I understand why Ivan wanted to be alone. I do not think it is because he wanted to be in isolation so that others did not see him suffer, but because he did not want his wife, who he never truly loved, to be around him. He resented her and most of those around him. I can understand that some do want to be isolated because they do not want loved ones to see them suffer.
Question 1:I believe it is important to recognize our own mortality because if we fail to do so we are left scrambling with end of life decisions and determining whether or not our lives were meaningful or not. Too often, especially in young people, we believe that we are undefeatable and will live forever. This is not so, and early recognition of our mortality will not only help us to make decisions for that time but we may be able to help others who have not given a thought to death.
ReplyDeleteQuestion 5: I know if I died today I would not be satisfied because I have this feeling there is still more I need to accomplish. However, I feel that I have lived a pretty damn good life so far and do not regret anything. I do not wish to "re-do" anything because those are mistakes I have learned from. My grandma and mom are always telling me to do this or that with my life so that I'll have a more meaningful life, well you know what I am the judge, jury, and executioner of my happiness and will take their opinion into consideration. I do not know what it is that I need to "discover" in order to have a meaningful life. I feel that once I have come across this "meaninful life" it will slap me in the face and then I will realize "Oh, this was what I was looking for", but until then I'm still searching to determine what is most meaningful.
q-1
ReplyDeleteIt is important to recognize your own mortality to recognize your own vitality. Often times we lose sight of meaning and take things for granted; the luxuries we enjoy, the food we get to eat, our family and friends... Sometimes, for us to realize this, they must be threatened to be taken away. Such works for life. We see it all the times in movies, books... but when it happens in real life is when it is instilled the most.
Q1: It's crucial to know your mortality because you don't want to be like Ivan, and look back on your life and realize that you haven't done everything you wanted to do. I think knowing your own death is a motivator to live your life to the fullest and knowing that it's okay to take risks and doing the crazier things in life. It also helps us appreciate what and who we have in our lives, because we never know if they will be gone.
ReplyDeleteQ5: I'm still young and I know I wouldn't be satisfied with dying. There are so many things I want to do and I can't do them until I reach like an old age. I feel like I've lived a good life with all the decisions that I've made. I have a great family that supports me, I go to a good school, and I appreciate everything I have so far in my life that I don't have any regrets thus far.
8. What message did you get out of this story (if any)? Any thoughts or opinions about Ivan that you would like to add?
ReplyDelete**I got a lot out of this story because it's so true with every case of death that nobody is ever ready for it and feels untouchable until they actually get a glimpse of what is happening to them. Panic and fear is what I want to avoid in my death and build up a confidence that I've done all I could at the end of the day to be a better person and be completely honest with every person that I come in contact with.
6. When a person is ill (with a death threating illness) is it right for them to not enjoy anything else in life? Should they separate themselves from their loved ones?
**I watched my best friend's mom deteriorate in front of me until the day they gave her 2 weeks to live and she embraced everyone around her rather than shutting herself of our lives. I would never want someone I love to suffer in silence and not enjoy what they have left with the people they have left.
5. When it comes to "redoing" situations in my life, I firmly believe that everything happens for a reason. I don't think things happen on accident.. But I truly do believe that the way you handle the cards you are dealt can change "fate". So, essentially, I believe we can control the emotions in our fate.
ReplyDeleteWith that being said, I don't think I have handled certain situations as well as I could have. I have had a very indecisive journey in college and have transferred schools twice--believing that happiness lied within a school, and not in the experience I made in that school. That is essentially where I would go back and redo. I would try harder to make a positive situation instead of relenting and waiting for it to fall in my lap.
The last thing I'd want to do is look back on my college experience and think that I lived it like Ivan. When it comes to college, society is full of it's own opinions and guidelines on how to do it the "right" way. I listened to a lot of those. I took too much heed in trying to satisfy my parents and those around me. In a sense I made a lot of decisions like Ivan did; however, I am a different and better person as a result of it. I'd like to think that I am stronger, with a better sense of identity and stronger sense of independence and self. *steps off soapbox*
Prompt # 1
ReplyDeleteI think that it is very important that we recognize our own mortality. Looking at Ivan, we do not want to end up in that situation. He avoided thinking about his death; he refused to recognize his own mortality. Ivan lived his life the way society told him to. He ignored the reality of death, and when faced with his own death, was not prepared to deal with it. It is important that we recognize our own mortality, so that we can live our lives out to their fullest potential. Death gives meaning to life, and recognizing our own mortality plays an important part in helping us live our life to its fullest. By recognizing our own mortality, we can be ensured to not end up like Ivan.
Prompt # 2
ReplyDeletePart of the joy in life is the people we met during our lifetime. Ivan separated himself from his family. He threw himself into his work, and ignored all other aspects of his life. And while it may have made him happy at the time, later he realized that his life was very unsatisfying. People today do the same thing. I know many people who just become so focused on work, and going through the day to day motions, that they never take the time to enjoy all that life has to offer. People miss out on some of life greatest moments. I have a friend whose father was not present at his son's birth because he was on a business trip. He is never home, and their family is always alone. It's sad because at some point the father is going to realize that his life has been unsatisfying. Sure he is very successful and is very rich, but he has thrown his life away, missing some of the greatest moment's life has to offer. Obviously people should not quit their jobs and enjoy life every second of the day every day, but for people like Ivan, who throw themselves into their work and separate themselves from their families and the rest of the world, they will eventually realize that their life is unhappy and unfulfilling.
Prompt # 3
ReplyDeleteThe reason that Ivan spoke to Gerasim was because Gerasim recognized the humanity of Ivan. Gerasim handled Ivan's impending death in a way much different than everyone else. It seemed like Gerasim was the only one who related to Ivan, and was able to understand what he was going through. That being said, I do think that Ivan should have involved his family more. Throughout his life, he constantly separated himself from his family, distancing himself so to focus more on his own selfish desires, namely his work. Death is not something people should be forced to go through alone. Families should function as support groups, helping its members through tough and trying times. A hallmark of what makes a family a family should be their ability to discuss anything. Gerasim was the most understanding, so it was good for Ivan to speak with him, but he should have also tried to talk with his family more. At the same time, from Ivan's perspective, it may not have been worth it to discuss it with his family. They viewed death in much the same way, refusing to recognize the reality of their own mortality. Either way, Ivan should have at least attempted to communicate with his family more. If anything, it may at least cause them to change their attitude towards death. Maybe opening up to them may allow them to recognize their own mortality, and in turn allow them to appreciate life while they still have the opportunity.